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VideoGamesSuck.com :: View topic - Prison population and cost
Just stumbled upon this intersting article showing that almost a quarter of the entire prison population of the world is incarcerated in the US (while having less than 5% of the world population).
It is true, there may be even more in China (apparently not all prisoners are counted there) but still China has 20% or so of the world population and it is a repressive dictatorship which you would expect to have much more prisoners because they have not only ordinary prisoners but also political prisoners.
What is this saying about the US? Do they lock up people for farting in public, are Americans more criminally inclined (you would expect this from the Australians, they are descendants of criminals), do they punish harsher, or all of this combined?
It is like the military budgets, you would expect the tax payers to demand that their money is spent more wisely, maybe this is what the voters want after all? Seems like a complete waste of money to me.
And this doc shows that one in 9 of all US black males ages 20 - 34 is in prison, that's pretty insane.
Re: Prison population and cost
Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 5:38 pm
Pogma
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berzerker wrote:
are Americans more criminally inclined (you would expect this from the Australians, they are descendants of criminals)
YOU STUPID FUCKEN CUNT!!!!!!!
_________________ Real men use a wheel!
Re: Prison population and cost
Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:59 pm
puk
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Location: Southampton, UK
First things first: I fully anticipate the Captn will try to derail this discussion
berzerker wrote:
J..almost a quarter of the entire prison population of the world is incarcerated in the US (while having less than 5% of the world population)...
What is this saying about the US...do they punish harsher
I think it's their republican mentality. You commit the crime, you do the time/pound of flesh and what not. For severe crimes (murder, rape, home invasion) I agree with this as criminals get a slap on the wrist here in Canada. But not with lesser crimes (see below
berzerker wrote:
It is like the military budgets, you would expect the tax payers to demand that their money is spent more wisely, maybe this is what the voters want after all?
Incarcerating people generates jobs, but I don't think it's a conspiracy.
berzerker wrote:
Seems like a complete waste of money to me...one in 9 of all US black males ages 20 - 34 is in prison...
Laws in the US unfairly treats blacks, but it's easy for us to say b/c we are not in the US. Four years in England and I would not hesitate to support a candidate which throws chavs in jail for 10 years for simple assault or robbery cases. I suspect it's the same in the US, people don't stop to wonder how the black people became the way they are, they just fear and resent them
Re: Prison population and cost
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:00 am
berzerker
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puk wrote:
First things first: I fully anticipate the Captn will try to derail this discussion
No, I think Suislide will step in with some redneck oneliner.
puk wrote:
I think it's their republican mentality. You commit the crime, you do the time/pound of flesh and what not. For severe crimes (murder, rape, home invasion) I agree with this as criminals get a slap on the wrist here in Canada.
Popular vote demands hard prison sentences because it seems 'fair' that someone pays for his crimes, and since even many judges and prosecutors are elected in the US, they tend to listen to this popular vote more than in most other countries I guess. Few people who thought it over a bit more will really think that higher prison sentences solve anything. Higher penalties deter hardly anyone from committing crimes, as proven by the high crime rates in the US already. Criminals usually do not anticipate being caught.
But by putting people away for a long time you prevent them from committing crimes in the meantime. However, because prisons are so overpopulated they can commit crimes in prison too, and they get an excellent education for a criminal career there, having served time severely diminishes their chances to get a proper normal job anyway.
I would think a better way to deal with this would be to educate people in prison, if you put them behind bars anyway, let try to use that time to see that they can become a valued member of society after they get out. But this runs contrary to the popular vote because that would be 'awarding' them for their crimes (still I do not see anyone volunteering for this award).
puk wrote:
Incarcerating people generates jobs, but I don't think it's a conspiracy.
No, these are low qualified and dangerous jobs no one wants in the first place. Taxpayers do not want to spend any more money on prisons, so you'll always be severely understaffed in an overpopulated prison.
puk wrote:
Laws in the US unfairly treats blacks, but it's easy for us to say b/c we are not in the US. Four years in England and I would not hesitate to support a candidate which throws chavs in jail for 10 years for simple assault or robbery cases. I suspect it's the same in the US, people don't stop to wonder how the black people became the way they are, they just fear and resent them
Is it a media thing like Michael Moore claimed? If you hear about violent blacks all the time, you are likely to treat blacks with suspicion. Here we have the same with immigrants form Morocco, you are inclined to treat them all as criminals, which then more or less becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:13 am
Pogma9
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LOL.
Anyone who's ever spent any amount of time in Australia would quickly conclude it's one of the most civilized nations in the world.
Now that we've dealt with that, we can focus on blacks and US crime rates.....
First....I want you bleeding heart cocksuckers to contemplate and then provide us with an honest answer regarding these scenario's....
1....Your wife is raped orally, vaginally and anally by 22yr old black man.
2....Your 12yr old daughter is raped orally, vaginally and anally by 22yr old black man.
3....Your wife is raped and killed by a 22yr old black man.
4....Your 12yr old daughter is raped and killed by a 22yr old black man.
Please provide prison sentences in their numerical orders 1-4.
Don't make the mistake of questioning my example, either answer what I've asked or stand mute.
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:54 am
Cabbie-Galah
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Pogma9 wrote:
LOL.
Anyone who's ever spent any amount of time in Australia would quickly conclude it's one of the most civilized nations in the world.
Now that we've dealt with that, we can focus on blacks and US crime rates.....
First....I want you bleeding heart cocksuckers to contemplate and then provide us with an honest answer regarding these scenario's....
1....Your wife is raped orally, vaginally and anally by 22yr old black man.
2....Your 12yr old daughter is raped orally, vaginally and anally by 22yr old black man.
3....Your wife is raped and killed by a 22yr old black man.
4....Your 12yr old daughter is raped and killed by a 22yr old black man.
Please provide prison sentences in their numerical orders 1-4.
Don't make the mistake of questioning my example, either answer what I've asked or stand mute.
I am standing while typing this. Your example is extreme and stereotypes all black mans as raping wives and daughters orally, vaginally and anally while being 22 years old. You disgust me sir.
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:35 am
berzerker
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Pogma9 wrote:
1....Your wife is raped orally, vaginally and anally by 22yr old black man.
2....Your 12yr old daughter is raped orally, vaginally and anally by 22yr old black man.
3....Your wife is raped and killed by a 22yr old black man.
4....Your 12yr old daughter is raped and killed by a 22yr old black man.
Please provide prison sentences in their numerical orders 1-4.
My answer would be that the prison sentences would be exactly the same as if the rapist was a 22yr old white male.
And in civilized countries it is not the family of the victims who determine the punishment, so I'm not sure why you, allegedly coming from one of those civilized countries, take "your wife" and "your daughter" as an example rather than "any women" / "any child". Apparently you think the punishments should be different if your family is affected?
Pogma9 wrote:
Don't make the mistake of questioning my example, either answer what I've asked or stand mute.
So you come barging into my thread and start determining the rules immediately?
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:49 am
Pogma9
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berzerker wrote:
My answer would be that the prison sentences would be exactly the same as if the rapist was a 22yr old white male.
Then WTF is this thread about?
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:25 am
berzerker
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About the fact that the US incarcerates so much more than the rest of the world, especially the civilized world. And in addition to the fact that the blacks are vastly overrepresented in the prison population, again unlike other countries.
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:23 am
Pogma9
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berzerker wrote:
. And in addition to the fact that the blacks are vastly overrepresented in the prison population, again unlike other countries.
Show us some evidence that suggests these blacks are innocent...
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 2:51 pm
berzerker
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Pogma9 wrote:
berzerker wrote:
. And in addition to the fact that the blacks are vastly overrepresented in the prison population, again unlike other countries.
Show us some evidence that suggests these blacks are innocent...
I'm not saying anyone is innocent, but the fact that the US are so different in this respect from other civilized countries, does have a meaning. It suggests that either of the following, on any of those in a combination, applies:
1. US blacks differ geneticly from other black and this genetic difference causes them to be criminals;
2. There is something in the US society that triggers blacks to become criminals, and this somehow much less triggers other ethnic groups and this is absent in most other countries or does somehow not affect blacks there);
3. The US legal system is somehow set up in such a way that it comes down much harder on blacks than on other ethnic groups.
I would think options 3 seems the most viable.
You deduction seems to be: young black males are vastly overrepresented in prisons, therefore young black males must be more criminally inclined than young males of other ethnic groups. That seems to be too simply put because then how does this explain that in Europe the same applies to young males with a Moroccan background, in Eastern Europe Gypsies, etc, why aren't blacks overrepresented anywhere?
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:23 pm
_Master_
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I'm a nigga in America and that much I flaunt
Cause when I see what I like
Yo I take what I want
I'm not the only one That's why I'm not bitter
Cause everybody is a nigga to a nigga!
Last edited by _Master_ on Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:12 pm, edited 1 time in total _________________ follow me or get out of the way
Re: Prison population and cost
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:22 pm
puk
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Location: Southampton, UK
berzerker wrote:
puk wrote:
First things first: I fully anticipate the Captn will try to derail this discussion
No, I think Suislide will step in with some redneck oneliner.
that's a given
berzerker wrote:
...Few people who thought it over a bit more will really think that higher prison sentences solve anything...But by putting people away for a long time you prevent them from committing crimes in the meantime...I would think a better way to deal with this would be to educate people in prison
There are two views to incarceration: retribution or rehabilitation. I don't agree that prisons rehabilitate you, so you might as well just not put them in prison. But I do believe in retribution since one should be held accountable for one's actions.
berzerker wrote:
puk wrote:
Incarcerating people generates jobs, but I don't think it's a conspiracy.
No, these are low qualified and dangerous jobs no one wants in the first place.
I disagree, look at the LAPD, it's an extremely attractive opportunity for people with no other job prospects, plus they get to shoot at people.
berzerker wrote:
puk wrote:
Laws in the US unfairly treats blacks, but it's easy for us to say b/c we are not in the US. Four years in England and I would not hesitate to support a candidate which throws chavs in jail for 10 years for simple assault or robbery cases. I suspect it's the same in the US, people don't stop to wonder how the black people became the way they are, they just fear and resent them
Is it a media thing like Michael Moore claimed...
I don't think so. It's just that Blacks are more violent, so they are more likely to harass you and when they do you resent them and push them out of society, which makes them violent, rinse, repeat
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:20 pm
Pogma9
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berzerker wrote:
I would think options 3 seems the most viable.
You deduction seems to be:
How can the US justice system be unjustly treating guilty people?.....you told me you didn't think these people were innocent.
I didn't make any deductions, I offered an example to check whether or not you were soft on hardcore fiends.
The problem in the US is the mix of wealth on display and the appalling parenting, ie, undisciplined, uneducated, unethical people can see the promised land right before their eyes but don't have the legal/moral capacity to obtain it.
Re: Prison population and cost
Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:23 pm
Pogma9
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puk wrote:
I disagree, look at the LAPD, it's an extremely attractive opportunity for people with no other job prospects, plus they get to shoot at people.
Not sure about the US, but in OZ, you need tertiary qualifications and have to be superfit to become a police officer.
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:29 am
puk
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Pogma9 wrote:
LOL.
Anyone who's ever spent any amount of time in Australia would quickly conclude it's one of the most civilized nations in the world.
Now that we've dealt with that, we can focus on blacks and US crime rates.....
First....I want you bleeding heart cocksuckers to contemplate and then provide us with an honest answer regarding these scenario's....
1....Your wife is raped orally, vaginally and anally by 22yr old black man.
2....Your 12yr old daughter is raped orally, vaginally and anally by 22yr old black man.
3....Your wife is raped and killed by a 22yr old black man.
4....Your 12yr old daughter is raped and killed by a 22yr old black man.
Please provide prison sentences in their numerical orders 1-4.
Don't make the mistake of questioning my example, either answer what I've asked or stand mute.
It doesn't even have to be that extreme. Some black guy lips you off on the bus and it ruins your whole day, then you hate them for life
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:31 am
Pogma9
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puk wrote:
It doesn't even have to be that extreme. Some black guy lips you off on the bus and it ruins your whole day, then you hate them for life
Not sure that this pop/puk psycho analysis contributes to this debate.
If the blacks are guilty, then they should be jailed, especially if it's an extreme crime or they're habitual criminals.
If there's a disproportionate number of blacks compared to everyone else, and you don't have any evidence to suggest they're innocent, then it's obvious that blacks are committing crime out of proportion to their numbers.
Re: Prison population and cost
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:31 am
Cabbie-Galah
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Posts: 71
Location: Beyond All Time
Pogma9 wrote:
puk wrote:
I disagree, look at the LAPD, it's an extremely attractive opportunity for people with no other job prospects, plus they get to shoot at people.
Not sure about the US, but in OZ, you need tertiary qualifications and have to be superfit to become a police officer.
Bullshit. Tertiary qualifications are desirable as is life experience, but those are not essential to join. Nor is being superfit, as long as you are at a level to perform the everyday duties of an officer.
Re: Prison population and cost
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:56 am
Pogma9
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Posts: 2522
Cabbie-Galah wrote:
Bullshit. Tertiary qualifications are desirable as is life experience, but those are not essential to join. Nor is being superfit, as long as you are at a level to perform the everyday duties of an officer.
maybe in your fucked up state, but not in QLD "asshead".....LOL.
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:01 am
berzerker
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Pogma9 wrote:
How can the US justice system be unjustly treating guilty people?.....you told me you didn't think these people were innocent.
[....]
If there's a disproportionate number of blacks compared to everyone else, and you don't have any evidence to suggest they're innocent, then it's obvious that blacks are committing crime out of proportion to their numbers.
No, if proves only that they are *convicted* disproportionally. So you could have a legal system that systematically convicts blacks in situations where others would not be convicted at all or less severely.
Of course you could also pass laws that make the behaviour of blacks criminal offences, then too you will be seeing disproportionate black convictions.
And please skip the examples of rapes, most crimes are drugs related.
What's the No 1 criminal ethnic group in Australia BTW? Must also be blacks I presume?
Pogma9 wrote:
The problem in the US is the mix of wealth on display and the appalling parenting, ie, undisciplined, uneducated, unethical people can see the promised land right before their eyes but don't have the legal/moral capacity to obtain it.
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